Viva Chavez!!! Viva Ortega!!!

VIVA LA REVOLUCION!!!!!!!!

http://kateablog.blogspot.com/2006/02/viva-la-revolucion.html

Viva Chavez!!! Viva Ortega!!!

VIVA LA REVOLUCION!!!!!!!!

“http://kateablog.blogspot.com/2006/02/viva-la-revolucion.html”:
http://kateablog.blogspot.com/2006/02/viva-la-revolucion.html

damn textiles!!!

“http://kateablog.blogspot.com/2006/02/viva-la-revolucion.html”:http://kateablog.blogspot.com/2006/02/viva-la-revolucion.html

fuck fuck fuck

http://kateablog.blogspot.com/2006/02/viva-la-revolucion.html

now you know why I don’t post more often

textiles sucks ass imho

So Chavez giving oil is a bad thing according to this article?

It’s so out of charecter for him…. or something.

Obviously he is up to no good…. or not.

link worked in the end Papa, so it’s all good.

The Sandinistas have been the first revolutionary government in world history to gain power that accepted electoral processes, which led to their loss of power. After defeating Anastasio Somoza, his army and his murderous National guard in a revolutionary war in 1979, the Sandinista government reorganized Nicaragua with the help of Cuba and the USSR. They also maintained a mostly capitalist owned business climate, but they did confiscate the property of the Somozas and their apparatchik.

Daniel Ortega was president of the revolutionary government and held elections in 1984, when he won what was considered a fair election by international observers. The neoliberal community contested the fairness and resented the Sandinistas, perhaps most of all for the confiscation of property. They worked against the Sanidinistas by accepting CIA strategems and supported the Contras counterrevolution that attacked Nicaraguan farmers, workers and government from Honduras and Costa Rica over almost ten years. Some of the funding for the Contras came from Iran/Contra-gate events and other funding came from Miami Somocistas and other CIA programs.

These pressures all helped to cause the loss of the presidential elections by Daniel Ortega in 1990 and 1996 and 2001, even while Nicaragua has still languished in one of the most extreme instances of poverty in the world while the U.S. favored candidates have held the presidency for the past 16 years. The U.S. has spent so much on war and repression in Nicaragua over the last century with political success, but has not been able to spend money well to produce economic success.

Nevertheless, the small population of Nicaragua remains divided between loyalty to U.S. interests and a desire for independence from U.S. domination. The class, political, ethnic and religious divisions in Nicaragua all play a role in its failure to find a harmonious development, even while there is a special literary and poetic eloquence that runs across the population’s categories of division.

Hugo Chavez’s oil deal may effect the political outcome in Nicaragua by helping to offset U.S. influence, even as the USSR had in the 80’s, but Chavez seems to just be doing his regular thing of these years in the Americas with oil. He does not appear to be fielding intelligence and military programs and implementing complex relationships directly with the class he favors in Nicaragua as the U.S. has traditionally done with the rich class.

When I want to quote the ONE instance of the armed branch of a revolution resisting the lure of dictatorship, it is Nicaragua.

hey guys, kind reminder of the other side of the Sandinistas:

_Sandinista troops committed their most controversial activities (as far as human rights are concerned) on the Atlantic Coast, including the forcible relocation of 8,500 Miskitos from their land and the destruction of up to 100 villages, activities which led to charges of genocide at the time. They also killed and imprisoned many indigenous people suspected of Contra collaboration. On two separate occasions in 1981 and 1982, Sandinista troops committed massacres in which approximately (UNHCR Report) 34 Miskito Indians died.

Another tactic used by the Sandinistas was the indiscriminate shelling of towns recently captured by the Contras, an action which was viewed by many as “punishment.” This Sandinista practice resulted in the Reagan Administration issuing orders to the Contra to stop further capture of cities and to concentrate on a “wasting” war while the U.S. was outspending the Soviet Union into bankruptcy, effectively curtailing the military support to the Sandinistas.

During the war Amnesty International and other groups alleged that political prisoners in Sandinista prisons, such as in Las Tejas, were beaten, deprived of sleep and tortured with electric shocks. They were denied food and water and kept in dark cubicles that had a surface of less than one square metre, known as chiquitas (“little ones.”) These cubicles were too small to sit up in and had no sanitation and almost no ventilation.

In the mid-1980s, under pressure from human rights organizations and widespread international condemnation, the Sandinista government acknowledged violations in its dealings with the Atlantic Coast and successfully negotiated an end to the southern front of the Contra war. In fulfillment of the terms of that negotiation, the National Assembly unanimously passed an Autonomy Law in 1987 that made Nicaragua the first Latin American nation to officially recognise its multiethnic nature, guaranteeing the economic, cultural, linguistic and religious rights demanded by the indigenous groups of the Atlantic Coast._

They did a lot of good things, but a lot of their side activities were fucking rotten. They were much worse than anything the U.S. is doing now in Iraq. They deserve the same amount of criticism. And it’s amazing to read guys like Chomsky gushing over them like they were saints.

They were much worse than anything the U.S. is doing now in Iraq.

Iraq is not a U.S. state nor part of U.S. territory and tens of thousands have died because of Desert Storm and the current occupation. Some reports are that hundreds of thousands have died including by starvation in Iraq because of American conduct in a foregin land.

The Sandinistas, on the other hand, were a full fledged revolutionary movement at war in the 70s and into the 80s in their own country. The Sandinistas have a lot of supporters among the Miskitos and these Atlantic Coast people have more autonomy than comparable communities in Guatemala and Costa Rica. They have voted in past elections and will vote in the next election.

If those contras were ex Somoza national guard … go ask the mother of a baby who was thrown in the air as target practice. Somoza’s national guard was the worst of the worst … if some were caught then there was some hard payback time. They were the trash of this earth.

The fact that the contras were horrible and violent doesn’t mean that the the sandanistia’s weren’t also prettty rotten.

Lot08, the Sandanistias tortured just like the US is doing now, but without a doubt even worse. The two massacres that I listed that their troops carried out were just the ones that were confirmed. There were doubtless many more. I’ve also seen reports by non-partisan legal groups in Nicaraguia before about violent stuff they did.

I haven’t seen an instance of the U.S. doing something as awful as indiscriminate shelling.

C’mon you guys, the fact that the U.S. opposed them doesn’t in any way excuse them for their human rights abuses. If anything, the fact that they weren’t US-supported makes it even worse.

go ask the mother of a baby who was thrown in the air as target practice

you could probably do the same with a member of the Miskitos or someone tortured by the Sandanistias.

Ssense. No sources, no credibility. Hyperlinks?

check out the wikipedia article on them. Email Amnesty International if you want.

You guys can’t tell me that the Sandanistias didn’t committ human rights atrocities.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9A0DE5D9173BF93AA15754C0A960948260

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FSLN_Human_Rights_Abuses
(The writing of this is biased, but it’s hard to dispute much of this)

http://www.indiancountry.com/content.cfm?id=1096410355

“Wiggins isn’t enamored of old ideologies. He was jailed for a month as a political prisoner during the dictatorship of Anastasio Somoza in the 1970s. In 1981, before joining ILRC, he was locked up again after a violent scuffle with Somoza’s successor, the Marxist Sandinista government. ‘‘I’ve been tortured by the physical torture of the right-wing system and by the psychological torture of the left-wing,’‘ he said matter-of-factly, adding that the Sandinistas were assisted in their labors by the former Stasi (secret police) of East Germany. “

http://www.cwis.org/fwdp/Resolutions/NCAI/nicarag.txt

No sources, no credibility.

I seem to have touched a nerve by not going along with the left-wing whitewash of the Sandinistas.

This reminds me of an argument I had with a leftist about Colombia and the FARC. He kept praising them and dismissing their atrocities until I told him I’d actually knew and talked with humanitarians that have worked in Colombia, and I told him to just try to tell them that the FARC was a force for good and see what happens.

No, no not all. I appreciate your attitude ssense but I need to be able to check your facts.

The Sandinistas were the target of a lot of disinformation. Hence actually picking out who the real Sandinistas is hard, from a messy historical record. It’s not a matter to me whether they were/are good or bad, just what exactly they were.

It’s not a matter to me whether they were/are good or bad, just what exactly they were.

Good, sorry to get annoyed, I just get ticked when otherwise intelligent people try to tell me that the Sandanistias or Castro were great people who should be saints.

They have voted in past elections and will vote in the next election.

wow, that was weak

and asking for links? come on guys, you all know how to google for yourselves, and human rights web archives of national reports are the easiest thing in the world to bring up, don’t be asinine for the sake of defending your good cheer about anti-american bloc strengthening in latin america

you’re acting like there’s some natural contradiction between the following two observations:
1. the sandanistas were not nice people during Nicaragua’s civil war
2. if Venezuela sways Nicaragua’s election to the left, American hegemony shrinks

It’s like you’re afraid of some third point linking 1 and 2, such as:
3. Chavez, like the Sandanistas, values power and uses populism while also making more machiavellian bids for power (he is obviously trying to determine the results of elections in other countries – if that’s considered unfair play, he’s impinging on democratic sovereignty, such as it is, in those countries). This is the same Chavez who embraced Mugabe after the slum clearings. Is he a revolutionary hero, or a populist riding a revolutionary wave of popular sentiment while consolidating personal power? The widely distributed new Venezuelan constitution does concentrate power in the presidency, at the expense of institutional democracy. Do you trust Chavez to realize the revolution more than you trust democratic process? If so, why so? He is accused of incrementalism, setting a precedent for democratic roll-back in the name of anti-imperialism. I think those accusations have merit, though I would rather see a left-leaning anti-american latin america than a neo-con guided free trade area. It’s just that, Chavez has a stated mission for his region’s future, and we love those statements. But are we prepared to hold this populist hero accountable when or if he turns hyporcrite? What if it doesn’t happen with a bang? Who will listen, if a whimper is the only early sign of Venezuela’s slip into totalitarian decline? Is this the precedent we want latin american countries to be embracing? Should we be glad every time Chavez scores a political coup, whatever the means? Does throwing cash at the poor while poverty rates are rising really count as socialist reform?

War is Hell. Human history is filled with war. In war, sides fight for their own lives, not just for the sport of killing the other combatants as if in a game. Group cohesion in war is a cohesion that involves fighting for the lives of the group, not just being in tight formation so as to perform well at killing others for points. Killing the others serves the purpose of life itself for the combatants, survival, a tremendously powerful motive, the most powerful motive. All of these conflicts, each of these conflicts is Hell for a species that might be united for ecological and human purposes.

The Miskitos that were massacred had enemy elements within, or were perceived as enemies who were serving the Somocista/American totalitarian despotism and that were out to kill the Sandinistas. The Sandinistas did not enjoy war or killing and were and are good, community oriented people. So is Castro. The Miskitos have voted in elections, are supported by the Sandinistas and will vote in the next elections. This “weak“ness of this democratic compromise is the new way to try to live in peace.

True, Lot. The Sandinistas wanted to oust US puppet Somoza. His regime was one of extreme cruelty. It is the US, under Reagan who set out (defying Congress in the process) to regroup the old Somoza national guard under the pseudo-legitimate label of Contra “freedom fighters”. Check out Sandino and what the US did to him and his followers.

_The Sandinistas wanted to oust US puppet Somoza. His regime was one of extreme cruelty. It is the US, under Reagan who set out (defying Congress in the process) to regroup the old Somoza national guard under the pseudo-legitimate label of Contra “freedom fighters”. _

I’m pretty sure everyone here already knew that.

The fact that Somoza was cruel doesn’t automatically mean the Sandanistias weren’t also.

I would have been cruel to Somoza’s government. Very cruel.

Interesting piece on the similarities between what the US MIC did to Nicaragua and what they’re doing now to Palestine.

Last I heard the US Ambassador approached the three parties planning to oppose Danny in the election — to try and consolidate the opposition — and they all told him to go to hell. LOL.

What I wanna know is, how we gonna get dem CAFTA shites outta der?