I wrote about this a while ago , if anyone cares; which nobody does.

The global warming threat is entirely exagerated. I do believe we need to curb our energy consumption, cut down on this and that and basically re-organize some things. But when whack jobs come out of the cracks and start saying that by 2050 a quarter of all species will be gone….it just knocks the wind out of any chance at credibility.

2050 is only 40 years away. Are we suposed to believe that 1/4 of the Earths species are going to die all at the same time?

Edgar Cayce ‘the sleeping prophet’ started this ‘earth change’ balogna way back in the early 1900s. Nutters have been looking for atlantis and trying to cure hemroids with bacon greece ever since. Pretty soon the oceans will flood the earth, atlantis will rise and we will rediscover the ancient fire crystal that will reveal all of earths mysteries to us.

My opinion is that there is warming going on. Probably more then our recent past. But I think our science is no where near ready to handle long-term global climate prediction. He don’t have the data or the computers to accuratly model this sort of thing.

that was a good blog tango – drewhempel should be flogged

The global warming threat is entirely exaggerated

There may have been some fuck-ups and exaggerations by the media and by scientists eager to be published. However, by and large, global climate change is a real, observable phenomenon with quantifiable risks to people and ecosystems .

[edited for clarity]

The global warming threat is entirely exagerated.

Says the cat who self-admittedly only started his research yesterday and pissed his pants when I posted a couple of abstracts (summaries of articles that are intended to be comprehensible to just about anybody.) Don’t be another fuckin’ anti-intellectual asshole who ignores the science, ice. You know shit about global warming; either learn or quit voicing your uneducated dissenting opinion.

By the way, don’t even fucking try that, “Oooh, the nasty global warming people are being all mean to me” line. If you wanna remain agnostic until you learn all about it, fine and great, good for you. But if you’re gonna start slagging it from a position of total cluelessness, you deserve every insult slung your way.

But I think our science is no where near ready to handle long-term global climate prediction.

Based on what? What? That’s an awful big statement for a fucking layman to make.

He don’t have the data or the computers to accuratly model this sort of thing.

Really. Explain why. If you can. Specifically, with examples, explained in good, technical detail.

I don’t think you can defend that statement, can you?

The global warming threat is entirely exagerated.

That’s an awesome conclusion given your one-day of avoidance of reading anything “technical”.

What a fucking douche.

But when whack jobs come out of the cracks and start saying that by 2050 a quarter of all species will be gone….it just knocks the wind out of any chance at credibility.

Grar! Again, Ice starts shooting his fucking mouth off about that which he is fucking clueless. I’d point you in the direction of the article, but it might be too fucking technical for you….in which case, why are you dismissing it out of hand? Oh, right…

I am cautious with people here like “ice”. Some people here seem to be very anti-gnn and so why are they posting here? I think they are paid.

Plus Bush and co. are planning a big “new” thing comeing soon. They are such children that they can’t help but leak thier own “plans” before hand. The Rum head himself in his most recent press con. said that a new terror event would most likely happen within the next 6 months and that it will be 5-6 times worse then 911. How does he know this like it is a fact. My “guess” is he isn’t guessing. Just in time for fall elections. What this has to do with this article is everything.

Tango, your blog directing attention to this film almost two months ago had reviews from Sundance audiences from almost three months ago. Your blog was great and the embedded film reviews carried similar kudos to the current reviews from some of the older media. The current reviews and my angle on this have become notably focused on Gore the man and politician, although if one works at it, it’s clear that I don’t believe that Gore is that important. He is another side of the MIC coin, but I think he may, in fact, become president. So, the whole course of machinations in the U.S. MIC political environment is important and winds up subjecting the geophysical environment to it, at its convenience. I really appreciate the intensity and conviction of the posters here and on the other several environment threads that the environment needs to guide our politics instead of vice versa. I just wish to keep this important group heads up when a Gore may wind up as (figurehead)political leader genuinely holding high our collective environment banner because I am convinced that he will be serving overall MIC strategies that are imperialistic, oppressive and will sacrifice or even wipe out any environmental publicity and substantive gains at the drop of a cap on the price of a barrel of oil.

TheSleepingKing,

Trust me, I’m not a paid agent. My view of GNN might be a bit slanted towards ‘anti-gnn’ but I bring up the reasons why I am slanted anti GNN with my blog. My reasoning is not crazy, mean, repetative, irrelevant etc. etc.. I am critical and skeptical and every issue I bring up is reasonable.

In short:

1 The ‘che lives rock on guerrilla’ theme is pointless and counter-productive. If you want to create a new kind of media that can help people better understand the world around them…why use propaganda packaging that pushes average people away. It’s like thug meets raver meets che wannabe meets ‘mol tov anarchist’

Also, I am not a new comer to this newsertainment web site. I’ve been screwing around here off and on since 2002 or so. I rarely take the site or it’s politics serious for the reasons above. Elitist, ‘fuck da police’, no focus, alarmist…

Think about it: A headline above reads:

“1/4 of all speices on Earth dead by 2050”

If half of the crap on this site were true then there would be no reason to post messages, do research, spread fear. Why? Because we are all fucked. If peak oil don’t get ya global warming will. And anyone who is left over get’s eaten by the New World Order Illuminati Blood Dragon. Oh, and don’t forget about the evil islamo-freedom haters that are in sleeper cells all around the country.

TheSleeping King,

Read Shogo’s and Snark’s posts and you will see my points. I never said I wouldn’t read technical data. I said I needed time to read this stuff and learn what it is saying.

You may want to read through our previous chats from yesturday on my blog and a few other discussion. They are right, I’ve only researched Global Warming very little. But I have not made any descision. I know how I feel about it at this moment. Maybe tomorrow or next week I will be convinced.

Shogo and Snark are just furious because I will not say “I agree 100% with you” without my own research into the subject.

You are the king of the straw man fallacy, huh ice?

If half of the crap on this site were true then there would be no reason to post messages, do research, spread fear. Why? Because we are all fucked. If peak oil don’t get ya global warming will. And anyone who is left over get’s eaten by the New World Order Illuminati Blood Dragon.

You twisted something nearly every legitimate scientist on the planet knows to be true into a crazy made up conspiracy theory only utter nutcases would believe in if it weren’t so outlandish.

You’re fucking pathetic. Do some research on logical fallacies or continue being a fucking tool/troll.

1/4 of all speices on Earth dead by 2050

A University of Toronto study

Published in Conservation Biology Journal

Summarized by MSNBC...

Yeah, real fuckin’ Guerilla, that one.

double

“As to his remarks, why would we take his opinion over the former vice presidents. What do they have to gain by scareing anybody. I said that the biggest hurricanes in our history would hit the gulf last year and they did. I wasn’t guessing. This year is going to be worse then last year. Bet on it.” ______thesleepingking

What is scary is that you are basically saying there is no reason to consider an apposing point of view on the basis that it doesn’t agree with your own. This is one of the main things I can’t stand about GNN.

i personally don’t think Al’s that great. he’s got his eyes on the problem, but the solutions he advocates are terribly inadequate.

he campioned the emissions trading policies, which in truth enables polluters to pollute more, and amounts to environmental racism.

have you guys been reading about this ‘global dimming’ phenomenon? double scary!

What is scary is that you are basically saying there is no reason to consider an apposing point of view on the basis that it doesn’t agree with your own. This is one of the main things I can’t stand about GNN

Dude, people aren’t considering your particular “apposing” point of view because they know it has been repeatedly and systematically dismantled, and because you are admittedly arguing from a position of ignorance.

Stop with the victim act, do your research, present your informed opinion, and be prepared to defend it from those who disagree. That or STFU.

What is scary is that you are basically saying there is no reason to consider an apposing point of view on the basis that it doesn’t agree with your own. This is one of the main things I can’t stand about GNN.

That’s what he’s saying? Did someone say “straw man”?

Let me clarify. My view is not apposing. I’m simply looking for facts. You’ve provided me with some good starting point articles but because I’ve not gotten on my knees and started praying to the Gods Of Global Warming you all think I’m against you in some way.

Don’t get all pissy because I don’t agree with you 100% and we won’t have a problem.

Don’t get all pissy because I don’t agree with you 100% and we won’t have a problem

Hahaha. I am all pissy over an internets post, right. Define having a “problem” with regards to the internets.

I’ve not gotten on my knees and started praying to the Gods Of Global Warming

Have you ever heard of a straw man fallacy? A better question is “does your mother know she raised a hypocrite?” The people who are arguing that global warming is a problem have actually brought some proof that hasn’t been blowed up, you however, are the one arguing from a place of ignorance and faith.

Fennec, I will rephrase then:

when you accept a dogma, you are no longer an independent researcher

“Hahaha. I am all pissy over an internets post, right. Define having a “problem” with regards to the internets.”

Yes, you have been pissy for 2 days now since I havne’t got on my knees and prayed to your God of Global Warming.

“Have you ever heard of a straw man fallacy? A better question is “does your mother know she raised a hypocrite?” The people who are arguing that global warming is a problem have actually brought some proof that hasn’t been blowed up, you however, are the one arguing from a place of ignorance and faith.”

Fennec,
Do you read the thread? I have not ruled out the possiblity. But, when someone tells me the sky is falling, I’d rather research in for more then a day or two before I join the clan. I know that seems strange to you but just trust me please. I am an open-minded skeptic and that is the only view I’ve expressed.

Yes, you have been pissy for 2 days now since I havne’t got on my knees and prayed to your God of Global Warming

Your delusional self-importance is showing.

when you accept a dogma, you are no longer an independent researcher

A dogma is defined as “An authoritative principle, belief, or statement of ideas or opinion, especially one considered to be absolutely true.”

I don’t consider global warming a “dogma” any more than I consider gravity “dogma”. Just because there is overwhelming evidence for both and little opposition to either and because I take little on faith from the admittedly ignorant—doesn’t make my views on global warming dogmatic.

when someone tells me the sky is falling, I’d rather research in for more then a day or two before I join the clan.

Have you been sleeping for the past few years?

Anyway, you aren’t arguing from the point of someone who hasn’t made up their mind yet. You are belittling the whole scientific community and those whom respect their research as crazy conspiracy theories. You are obviously and admittedly ignorant, but your patronizing tone of the predominant theory of global climate change is telling. You’re in the fringe on this one, stop pretending otherwise. Stop pretending your views, which are also held by corporate whores and religious fundamentalists, are superior to those of people who have been trained to study and have studied this and other atmospheric phenomena since they got their phds.

I am an open-minded skeptic and that is the only view I’ve expressed.

Bullshit. Your arguments are akin to saying “you’re fucking crazy, as are your views, but I swear I am open minded.” We’ve done research. I trust independent scientists more than the wilfully ignorant. Get over it. You aren’t a skeptic, you just think you are.

Fennec,

YOu are way off base. The description you stick on me is exactly the same thing I’m saying in my blog “Global Warming Advocates Are Thugs”.

I was labeled an idiot for not agreeing with Shogo and Snark in ONE DAY of researching. Because I didn’t get on my knees after asking one question and getting a few links they get all pissy and act like enviro-thug thought police. If I was not a skeptic would I still be reading stuff on global warming, co2, Thomas Patterson, Hansen, computer modeling, like I have been for 2 days now?

I doubt it. Back to my article entitled “Slamming the Climate Skeptic Scam”

“Bullshit. Your arguments are akin to saying “you’re fucking crazy, as are your views, but I swear I am open minded.” We’ve done research. I trust independent scientists more than the wilfully ignorant. Get over it. You aren’t a skeptic, you just think you are.”

Did someone say ‘straw-man’ ? Does your mother know she raised a hypocrite?

Global Dimming – I saw a peice yesterday to the effect that one of the largest climate simulations run to date (using surplus computing power of many briton’s) was thrown off by the effects of global dimming. BBC documentary about it is pushed back 2 months, when they’ll release the data.

or Tango’s blog

YOu are way off base.

If half of the crap on this site were true then there would be no reason to post messages, do research, spread fear. Why? Because we are all fucked. If peak oil don’t get ya global warming will. And anyone who is left over get’s eaten by the New World Order Illuminati Blood Dragon. Oh, and don’t forget about the evil islamo-freedom haters that are in sleeper cells all around the country.

You just strung everything together as if they were all connected or at least as likely as eachother. Don’t shit yourself.

Because I didn’t get on my knees after asking one question and getting a few links they get all pissy and act like enviro-thug thought police.

They got “all pissy” because of comments like the one I put in bold above. You attacked something with a huge and solid base of evidence as if it were ridiculous because you researched for a half an hour (and by “research” I mean you googled looking for “evidence” which reenforced your preconceived notions). Or maybe you just went for the simplest explanations, and by simplest I mean in more of a small bus, easier to understand, directed towards the lowest common denominator sort of way…

enviro-thug thought police

You attack people by calling them thugs and nutcases and they are the thought police when they return your disrespect? Shit.

I said I needed time to read this stuff and learn what it is saying.

If that were true, then you wouldn’t lead off a post with: “The global warming threat is entirely exagerated.”

That’s not the statement of someone earnestly trying to figure something out. It’s a conclusion (a baseless one), argued from your self-confessed ignorance of science.

ice, if you’re angry about being owned all over this site over the last couple days, there is a simple way to resolve that. Stop being a fucking idiot.

Also, if you keep posting like this don’t ever expect anyone else to say “ice was right” again.

I get defensive when I’m attacked for being skeptical. I rarely attack anyone before they attack me, call me a name etc. etc.

They did get pissy because I won’t start praying to their God Of Global Warming from the get go.

By the way, I have no case or point of view to push here. I’m skeptical and will most likely always remain skeptical. I do believe humans actions affect the climate. I do believe the climate been getting warmer.

WHere I get skeptical is when people post things like “Quarter of Earths Species Gone By 2050” and other doomsday scenarios.

That said, I personally take actions in support of environmentalist positions. I support research in new energy, i support laws to cut back on CO2 emmissions and I support climate science research.

I’ve recently save a few thousand dollars and have been reading about using biodiesel in a VolksWagon Diesel Engine Jetta. I am a little wary but I did see a car in northern PA at a renewable energy presentation of some sort that ran of used cooking oil of some kind.

Years ago one of the very first web sites I made…shit probalby the first…was here:

http://www.hemp4fuel.com

I rarely attack anyone before they attack me

Calling people “thugs” is sometimes considered an attack.

They did get pissy because I won’t start praying to their God Of Global Warming from the get go.

No, they got pissy because you pretended that global warming was an insane theory and that the people who recognize it are fringe nutcases.

I’m skeptical and will most likely always remain skeptical.

You’re skeptical of global warming, but were very quick to condemn those who hold the prevailing and most likely correct view. That’s not skeptical. That’s biased.

WHere I get skeptical is when people post things like “Quarter of Earths Species Gone By 2050” and other doomsday scenarios.

When the same basic results come from mainstream sources and masses of highly respected scientists, it really doesn’t matter what is hard for you to believe. Just because you can’t wrap your head around the science doesn’t make the science wrong, it makes you small minded.

I guess we all have our own version of how things go down, especially regarding forum style communications like these.

If you ask me, that seems to be a popular method of discourse when you disagree with the GNN Establishment. I’m sure i do my own part by inflaming the discourse with some of my own choice words and I’ll work on that.

I apologize if I seemed like I was calling people lunatics for believing in catastrophic immediate threats from Global Warming. I still don’t believe we are about to destroy ourselves. I think if were were going to have 25% of all species on Earth extinct in 2050 then it would be a little more obviously occuring, not

“could happen” or “about to happen” or “possibly thinking of abou to happen”.

The best is:

“could face possible extinction”

I apologize if I seemed like I was calling people lunatics for believing in catastrophic immediate threats from Global Warming.

Let’s wait and see how this year’s hurricane season plays out. If Australia is any indication, the Gulf Coast is fucked (again).

I apologize if I seemed like I was calling people lunatics for believing in catastrophic immediate threats from Global Warming. I still don’t believe we are about to destroy ourselves. I think if were were going to have 25% of all species on Earth extinct in 2050 then it would be a little more obviously occuring

it already is occuring, and it’s fairly obvious.

do a little research into the number of species that have gone extinct in the last 50 years, or have been added to the endangered species list in the same amount of time.

“I’ve recently save a few thousand dollars and have been reading about using biodiesel in a VolksWagon Diesel Engine Jetta. I am a little wary but I did see a car in northern PA at a renewable energy presentation of some sort that ran of used cooking oil of some kind.”

I’ve been running a diesel VW Jetta on biodiesel for over 3 years now (since the Iraq invasion began). It works great and has a lot less emissions. I highly recommend it. Let me know if you have any questions about the product or it’s use.

“do a little research into the number of species that have gone extinct in the last 50 years, or have been added to the endangered species list in the same amount of time.”

I will. All of these things are highly politicized so there is much crap to sift through. For example, I did a google.com search to find listings of “climate experts” and the entire first 20-40 pages are nothing but “Scientist Says He’s Muzzled By Bush Admin”

“I’ve been running a diesel VW Jetta on biodiesel for over 3 years now (since the Iraq invasion began). It works great and has a lot less emissions. I highly recommend it. Let me know if you have any questions about the product or it’s use.”

That’s awesome. You didn’t happen to purchase the kit from GreaseCar.com did youi? Or did yiou make your own modifications? Did you make any?

I’m looking for a diesel jetta, rabit or truck of some sort. If you know of any please let me know.

“That’s awesome. You didn’t happen to purchase the kit from GreaseCar.com did youi? Or did yiou make your own modifications? Did you make any?”

Straight vegetable oil (SVO) requires about a $600 modification to allow a diesel vehicle to run on both conventional diesel (or biodiesel) and SVO. Biodiesel, on the other hand, does not require any modifications. Put it in the vehicle and go.

As a caveat to that last statment, biodiesel is highly corrosive. Any natural rubber parts in your fuel system will need to be replaced with synthetic rubber eventually. You can let it go for a while but once you start springing leaks it’s time to change some stuff out. Most of it’s fairly simple, but if you have a natural rubber o ring in your fuel pump you’ll need to replace it (most newer vehicles no longer use natural rubber BTW). Mine wore out after about a year of running the vegi-diesel. The cheapest way to get this O ring replaced is to UPS the pump to this company in Portland OR that specializes in rebuilding diesel fuel pumps. The cost savings is enormous over buying a rebuilt one. Their number is 503-234-5241.

The only other consideration is that the fuel will completely clean all the gunk out of your tank and fuel system after a tank of fuel has run through. You’ll need to replace the fuel filter after the first tank is run through. Other than that it’s just like using normal fuel.

Where do you live? I can help point you to some resources to locate a local biofuel outfit. It’s usually around$3 a gallon, but is renewable, domestic and is 100% blood free.

Here’s a website for a group I first started buying fuel from. They’re really cool guys and their site is informative. http://www.sqbiofuels.com/

“I’m looking for a diesel jetta, rabit or truck of some sort. If you know of any please let me know.”

Yeah, good choices. The only real vehicles in the US that run on diesel are either these VW products, some full size trucks of all makes (the GMC/Chevy Suburban also comes in diesel sometimes- gets about 20 mpg) or you can go with a Mercedes 240 or 300 d. I have experience owning and using biodiesel with a VW jetta and a couple Mercedes vehicles. Either of these would be fine choices.

Finding one can be tricky. The most successful place to find one would be eBay or craig’s list or some such thing. I spent months searching all types of car websites in a 3 state area and had a very hard time finding diesel vehicles. However an eBay search came up with many options, but not all of them were in the local area. If you happen to live in Oregon here’s a good resource. http://www.greaseworks.org/dieselshop

If you happen to be rolling in the dough, you could buy a new TDI from a VW dealer. Let me know if I can help you further in locating a vehicle or biodiesel supplier. If I lose track of this thread you can always send my profile a message.

“if you happen to be rolling in the dough…”

Nope. I want to purchase something VERY inexpensive. I have some limited knowledge of engines and working on cars and my dad is an expert so i don’t mind paying very little and fixing it up. It has to run out of the box though.

Did you buy the greasecar kit?

update: I live near Philly.

No, I didn’t buy a kit. I bought a diesel vehicle and put the biodiesel in it. You have to change the fuel filter after one tank but that’s it. Plug and play.

A greasecar kit is only necessary if you want to be able to use Straight Vegetable Oil (SVO), like going into a mcdonalds and asking them for the contents of their greasetrap (people do that, some restaurants are happy to comply).

I prefer to use Biodiesel, which can be put in an unmodified diesel vehicle and driven away.

For the price range you’re looking to spend, I’d recommend a 1980’s jetta/rabbit/VW truck or an older mercedes diesel vehicle. You should be able to find one of either model for about $1000 – $2000. Once you own one, find some biodiesel and put it in the tank.

You shouldn’t have to worry about replacing any tubes or rubber parts in the fuel system for several months, and if you keep an eye on it from time to time you can see where drips begin to form. Again, it took my fuel pump a year to begin to fail on me. If the vehicle has synthetic rubber in the fuel system it may never need to be changed out. My ’79 M Benz 300SD has been running fine for more than a year and I never replaced anything.

I just found a good resource from the Philly area. There’s a list of FAQ’s and a list of places to hook up the fuel. Check it out. http://www.phillycleancities.org/biodiesel.htm

2050 is only 40 years away. Are we suposed to believe that 1/4 of the Earths species are going to die all at the same time?

Man could never have that drastic an impact on another species on Earth in such a short period of time. Just look at the positive impact mankind has made on the passenger pigeon , dodo bird , great auk , Siberian Tiger , American Bison, & California/Mexican Grizzly in a short span of recent history.

Nope. I want to purchase something VERY inexpensive. I have some limited knowledge of engines and working on cars and my dad is an expert so i don’t mind paying very little and fixing it up. It has to run out of the box though.

Try a pogo stick.

“Try a pogo stick.”

Or a bike. Cheap and easier on the equilibrium.

I’d like to point out that while Mr Ice may be a bit off base in his view of global warming (IMO), he’s actively pursuing options that will help improve his own contribution to the problem. Who else among us is doing that?

Those of us arguing with him about the esoteric intangibles of the whole situation might want to think about that.

I think if were were going to have 25% of all species on Earth extinct in 2050 then it would be a little more obviously occuring, not

The current extinction rate is between a thousand and 10,000 times what it should be. A thousand times its normal rate, at the absolute least.

A little bit of non-technical proof.

And here’s another article from PBS.

“The background level of extinction known from the fossil record is about one species per million species per year, or between 10 and 100 species per year (counting all organisms such as insects, bacteria, and fungi, not just the large vertebrates we are most familiar with). In contrast, estimates based on the rate at which the area of tropical forests is being reduced, and their large numbers of specialized species, are that we may now be losing 27,000 species per year to extinction from those habitats alone.”

Emphasis mine. Disregard the bacteria; those little fuckers have basically infinite biodiversity and will never go extinct.

I did some research into biodiesel vs. SVO and it seems that the latter is kind of shitty by comparison. Biodiesel does seem to be a better way to go for sure, the trick is finding places to buy it, since I’m not keen on poisoning myself with methoxide.

You have preheat SVO, so the viscosity is low, to get the diesel injectors to work without gumming it up. Biodiesel is already lower viscosity, because it’s been transesterified, and doesn’t require a tank and fuel line heater. Easier to use in cold weather, too.

If only we could develop a car which ran on bullshit.

I think if were were going to have 25% of all species on Earth extinct in 2050 then it would be a little more obviously occuring [sic]

Hey Ice, you seem to be really hung up on this, did you even get past the headline?

I know it seems elaborately alarmest ; however, the original University of Toronto study that Jay Malcom released was a study of global biodiversity with the startling conclusion that:

Projected percent extinctions ranged from <1 to 43% of the endemic biota (average 11.6%), with biome specificity having the greatest influence on the estimates

But the foundation that funded it (WWF) needed a more attention grabbing way to present this data. Their quote about “25% of all species on Earth extinct in 2050” was taken by media outlets, who ran with it, unnecessarily casting doubt on the original study.

But hey, that’s how it works. A climate change scientist knows they’ll be torn to shreds in the literature if they made an unfounded claim. However, some environmental organizations and the media are often rewarded for alarmist propaganda.

If you’re going to use this one headline as your basis for ignoring global warming (while discounting every other reputable study in the process), than you should at least understand how the flow of information works.

If you truly wish to understand the subject, than go back to those abstracts that Snark posted and start reading, devoid of bias, and you may see that the original data is quite sound, and not nearly as sensationalist as this single headline from a news report quoting a WWF employee quoting a scientific paper you seem to be basing your rejection of global warming on.

Man could never have that drastic an impact on another species on Earth in such a short period of time. Just look at the positive impact mankind has made on the passenger pigeon , dodo bird , great auk , Siberian Tiger , American Bison, & California/Mexican Grizzly in a short span of recent history.

Then you can look at those we have critically endangered. That would be almost every whale and river dolphin species, gray and red wolves, each greater ape, every lemur species, 1/3 of our closest relatives: primates (and that is not to be confused with those that are only endangered or threatened), cheetahs, wild dogs, black and white rhinos, African and Indian elephants, and many many more. Now, I am just mentioning the mammals, and mainly the highly visible ones. Think about how many you haven’t heard of or seen pictures of. The fossas which hunt lemurs. Not only the great pandas, but the red pandas. I’ll stop now, but if you think all of these animals and many of them keystone species can drastically die off or go extinct without having an effect on the lesser known species and vice versa, you’re insane.

If only we could develop a car which ran on bullshit.

That would be perfect for ice.

This video of Triumph the insult comic dog interviewing skeptical republicans is pretty familiar

Goddamn that was funny. Or I should say it was funny until I considered that those dumbfucks are actually in positions of power.

How about Will Ferrell?

“You have preheat SVO, so the viscosity is low, to get the diesel injectors to work without gumming it up. Biodiesel is already lower viscosity,”

Yup, for SVO you need 2 tanks, one with the regular fuel and one with the SVO. You run the veh until it’s warm then switch tanks.

I prefer my biodiesel. Smells like french fries too.

Lots of places are cropping up to supply those who demand it. I’m happy to help anyone find a local source if they’d like.

You guys are getting too wound up about Ice’s opinions.

For me, it’s not necessarily about Does Global Warming exist ? I think it sure does. But my questions are more like: How bad is it? How effectively can it be gauged to arrive at fairly good projections? And given what limited data we have about longterm climate fluctuation & cycle, how much ‘warming’ is not man-made and how much is directly caused by man-made fossil fuel consumption? One has to admit, given what little we know of pre-industrial history, the Earth has apparently cooled and warmed, in subtle increments many times. And while I believe the ozone is getting eaten by pollution, we still don’t have longterm ozone data, for any comparisons.)

True or false, there’s so much hype about G.W. (which is taught in all the schools here) that it’s not exactly a secret either. Are energy multinationals really so desperate, powerful, and active in stamping out every mention of it? I doubt it. In the end, a lot of the global pollution actually is generated outside of America anyway. Check China, for example. The place is a smoke-stack, coughing toxins right across the Pacific.

The energy-friendly Pentagon has even proclaimed all sorts of climate degradation scenarios, even going so far as to say the UK might become nearly uninhabitable, and Siberia turning into marsh.

Anyway, whether they position X or Y is right or wrong, there still should be room for non-alarmist positions. Let the debates rage on and bring out the best data.

there still should be room for non-alarmist positions [continuity]

indeed

Some measureable degree of fluctuation in temperature and other climatic phenomena may have been fortuitously influenced by human activity. We may simulataneously be just near the right stage of technological development and motivation to figure out how to keep earth from fluctuating too much for thousands or tens of thousands of years to come, to prevent ice ages and ice melting, to keep our lovely, stirred, but not shaken, just cool enough martini planet perfectly sippable for endless generations to come.

This does not have to be a fantasy and the stakes may be life or death. I think we may only have about two generations to figure things out otherwise the planet may really go through Hell and then freeze over — you know the expression. I also think that world population reduction and maintenance is essential and that a political unification of the planet is necessary for that and the concomitant world prudent and just resource (water, energy, metals, etc.) and labor management.
I’d hope argument could get us there IN TIME, next more or less conventional/low WMD world wide warfare and finally Ebola. Like I’d totally deplore the extinction of the earth species to go on until there’d be a tens of thousands of year lapse until a possible rehumanization of the planet.

Lets be honest. Nothing will change untill people are forced to change. And I dont mean by governments or well intentioned rock concerts or funny Will Ferrel videos.

Peak oil, or an ice age.

It will take massive deaths.

Massive.

If you’re right, then that’s what will be.

“It will take massive deaths.

Massive.”

Don’t worry guys, when the rapture comes the rest of us will have lots of room to spread out. The governement is even legislating our policies with this in mind.

There is no global warming. Polar bears are drowning because they aren’t intelligent enough to buy inflatable rafts at Wallmart. We haven’t had the warmest winter in 50 years in my area. I don’t have problems breathing through all that pollution, it’s in my head, I’m an idiot.

Will Al Gore decide that the best way he can carry out his ecological mission is to run for president again? Right now, he still says he’s not interested.

From Common Dreams
Originally published on May 19, 2006 by Reuters
Gore in Movie Campaign to Protect Earth
by Thomas Ferraro

WASHINGTON – Al Gore brushes aside talk of another run for the U.S. presidency and wages a new campaign to protect the Earth that he says must be won.

The former Democratic vice president sounds the alarm as a citizen activist armed with his old slide show turned into a Hollywood movie about the threat of global warming.

“My whole objective here is to try to move the country past a tipping point, beyond which politicians in both parties compete with each other for genuinely meaningful solutions … and to change the minds of the American people to the point where people in both parties demand action,” he said….

(continues at Common Dreams link above)

The Washington Post
has an op ed piece today that continues to look at Al Gore’s crusade and possible candidacy.