i still don’t understand why Hezbollah’s leaders wouldn’t be telling the media this if it were true.

that picture says it all,
little boys capturing flags. too bad they had to murder so many children to play their game…

Anthony, I’m not sure if you were aware of this or not, but a few of us were trying to get this published on the GNN front door. Thank you and Joshua for realizing how important this controversial story is.

i still don’t understand why Hezbollah’s leaders wouldn’t be telling the media this if it were true.

Hezbollah has claimed that the Israelis were captured in Lebanon the entire time.

Thanks for paying attention.

C – yeah, I left notes about Aaron’s headline

I finally found it. Okay, I also understand the point you made under Aaron’s headline. The matter should be approached as a question, because it is. I doubt we’ll ever get to the bottom of it, though as long as people keep asking questions and this war isn’t as seen as evil Hezb started it for no reason, I’m satisfied.

Hey march,

can you offer a link to a source that indicates where Hizbollah said as such? I have followed some of Nasrallah’s speeches and have not come across any reference to the soldiers being captured on the Lebanese side of the border, but this can be because I was too not paying close enough attention. I do not have the time right now to look into it myself in more detail, so I would appreciate a link if you have a minute.

But, on second thought, in his first speech after the Israeli attacks, Nasrallah does say

The battle today is no longer a battle over prisoners or the exchange of prisoners. It might be said that the Zionist enemy is responding any time there is any operation where men are captured anywhere in any part of the world, by any army or any state that has borders and regulations. What is taking place today is not a response to a capture of their soldiers; it is a squaring of accounts with the people, resistance, state, army, political forces, regions, villages, and families that inflicted that historic defeat on that aggressive usurper entity that has never accepted its defeat

which emphasizes that the Israeli soldiers were captured by an “army or state that has borders and regulations” ...so this may be a not so implicit reference to an Israeli transgression preceeding the Hizbollah attack.

And the Israelis will never be charged since the determining body of acts of aggression is the UN Security Council and we all know how that works 180(the world)-2(US & Israel).

singh, marchhare is just trying to troll. of course he doesn’t know what hezbollah has to say about it.

A burned Israeli humvee that was part of a convoy attacked by Hezbollah guerillas where two Israeli soldiers were captured, is seen on a road between Zarit and Shtula in northern Israel, on the border with Lebanon, Wednesday, July 12, 2006. Hezbollah fighters launched a raid into Israel and captured two Israeli soldiers Wednesday, triggering an Israeli assault with warplanes, gunboats and ground troops in southern Lebanon to hunt for the captives. Seven Israeli soldiers and two Lebanese were killed in the violence.

Picture by the AP.

That picture kind of confirms for me that this attack took place in Israel. Anyone have an alternative explanation for this?

source

You all act as if Israel is the holy grail of nations, yet I seem to remember that Israel was created based on a hokey religious book, that issued out of an old Iraqi city known as Babylon, just north of Baghdad (I think the US army uses it as a parking lot now for trucks), upon which other hokey religions were founded, one allied and one opposed to Israel’s hokey religion, but the saddest part is that, much like in North America when the White Invaders… ahem “settlers” showed up, they paid the wrong party for the land they took (example, the tribe native to Rhode Island was paid by the Dutch for the land area of what is today NYC/Manhattan. The tribe dwelling there took offense and took up arms, and the Dutch hid behind their pallisades and artillery while the two tribes went at it… making it easier for the Dutch to then claim that the winners were “all indians, all the same, and backing down from their deal after being paid a few pittance beads and articles of clothing for their land”... yeah… easy mop up for men with guns and artillery against natives with bows and arrows.

Fast forward to 1948… One British Lord Balfour and three banking houses (Rothschild – Germany, Rothschild – England and Rockefeller – United States) sink their fangs into the fresh UN, and get them to charter Israel, as a new form of Ghetto in which to concentrate all the Zionist Jews (also known as Hebrew speakers). The Zionists seem to be diametrically opposed to the Socialist Yiddish Jews. I forget the term, Bundists or somesuch. These would be the followers of the Diaspora idea, where the Jews scatter to the corners of the world and take their culture with them, creating distributed communities, ensuring both their faith and their culture survives anything short of a planetary wipeout (something people in 1948 weren’t quite so afraid of or aware of just yet).

Strangely, Yiddish is outlawed in Israel, with the Zionists allowing only for Hebrew to be spoken. The Yiddish side of Judaism is on its way out due for extinction sooner or later, but what really amuses me is that one has but to READ the Torah, the Biblia (Old Testament) and notice all of the LOVELY genocides the “People of Israel” committed, from teh FIRST FOUNDING of Israel (or so the hokey religion would have us believe) which was a genocide through and through, to other fine genocides (I believe Daniel was in charge of one, Isaiah of another) and the ONLY nation that withstood their intolerant, vicious onslaught was BABYLON... I wish I could remember the exact verse, but it was only in Babylon that they were defeated in the ancient world of the Old Testament.

And don’t even bring up the argument of anti semitism, Shem begat Abraham, and Abraham had a son named Ishmael, whom he banished, along with his mother to the desert. And from that point on the Old Testament forgot them, but the Quran picked up from that point, and Islam was born.

off-topic lecture monitor set to ignore.

Voting-down sensen’s shit….
Activated!

Sens, it is more important to acknowledge the disparity in the reporting and show that a true consesus does not exist. Therefore an investigation prior to military action should have been obvious before anyone backed the Isreali war on Lebanon.

Has sense complete left you?

Therefore an investigation prior to military action should have been obvious before anyone backed the Isreali war on Lebanon.

Exactly, but the plan for war was at least one year older than the actual catalyzing event. And the warplan might go back to 2001 and earlier. They’re not about to investigate and negotiate when a big plan is about to come to fruition.

Either way, the soldiers were pawns and I’m sure Tel Aviv and Washington were quite happy they were kidnapped, so they could get their freak on.

I really don’t understand why no one is talking about this, Israeli or Lebanese. Has anyone seen an Israeli report which describes the town the soldiers were ‘kidnapped’ in or the circumstances of their capture? Has anyone seen a Hezbollah version of events? All I’m hearing is the mainstream media’s assertion that the Israelis were captured in Israel, without evidence or confirmation. It’s bizarre.

_Therefore an investigation prior to military action should have been obvious before anyone backed the Isreali war on Lebanon.

Has sense complete left you_

it’s not my fault that Israel is run by assholes.

the picture I posted won’t come up now, but I’m waiting for an alternative explanation on the picture, because otherwise it shows quite clearly that the patrol was on the Israeli side.

All I’m hearing is the mainstream media’s assertion that the Israelis were captured in Israel, without evidence or confirmation

so I the picture I posted is fake?

in another post in which myself and ‘non’sense are butting heads over the killing of Dr. Kelly, i talk about the importance of checking sources.
sense’s post here is written by ZIENA KARAM who has written about munich, anti-Syrian protests in Lebanon, anti-Syrian political assasinations, and a TWA hijacker who killed an american. She seems to be based in beruit, but writes for the chicago sun times (which has nothing on lebanon on it’s front page , but does talk about sharon), and the desert sun news (both of whom don’t seem to have run her article posted by sense)...
on her website looks to be without any info, except her links, which refer to a site called lebweb, which links to stories from AP, Reuters, Washington Post etc., but i see no links to Lebanese based periodicals, or even mid-east based organizations…

the article sense is referrring to is in a washington based rag called wtop, but was also picked up by foxnews, msnbc, and something called the examiner.com… nice find sense

the picture is also of a burned out humvee, nothing more. it could have been fired up by hezbollah after they engaged forces that had entered Lebanon. The picture is crap, and means nothing on it’s own…

araboo is another link on her site, which is in english, and most of the stories are from western media. hmnn….

I cannot say conclusively that Hezbollah did not conduct a cross-border raid when abducting the soldiers. As it stands, I base my analysis on the conflict on the premise of Hizbollah conducting a raid onto the Israeli side of the border…and such a premise still in no way justifies the destruction of an entire country. I have now read some speeches and interviews given by Nasrallah, and I have not found any reference to Hezbollah as acting in accordance with its sovereign juridical right to have captured the soldiers since they transgressed Lebanon’s integral borders. Instead, what I gather is that Hezbollah had planned this raid for a long time, as Nasrallah and other Hez leaders had understood this, from past experience, to be the only means of securing the release of Lebanese prisoners held in Israeli prisons. This is something that Hez understood to be an urgent humanitarian issue, and so unlike the Israeli occupation of the Shebba (sp?) farms, this could not wait.

In the Al-Jazeera interview that was posted as a headline, Nasrallah also indicates that Hez had not anticipated such a brutal reaction from the Israelis, as experience had led them to believe that while there may have been limited strikes, there would nonetheless have been a process of negotiating a prisoner exchange. Interestingly enough, he places the blame for this unexpected outcome not entirely on Israel, but more principally on the “international community,” as he claims that it was only due to the “cover” provided Israel by the US, UK, Canada, the Arab leaders, that it was possible for Israel to express such a relentless and vicious military solution. Again, this leads one to believe that it is very likely that Hez crossed into Israeli territory to conduct the raid. However, at the same time, it is also entirely possible that Hez was waiting for the moment that the Israelis would transgress the border, or used some sort of tactic to draw them across the border, and use the opportunity to execute the obviously well planned raid.

Nonetheless, cross-border or not, Israel and the so-called “international community” obviously did not approach such a development in a manner that can be in any way rationalized as being committed to ensuring peace, both for its neighbours and for itself.

And also, to echo what was already said, Israel also obviously used the Hezbollah raid to set in motion the long planned destruction of the state of Lebanon.

the associated press photography has been duped by an evil Israeli conspiracy, and only pumo knows about it.

in another post in which myself and ‘non’sense are butting heads over the killing of Dr. Kelly, i talk about the importance of checking sources

pumo here is really unhappy because I pointed out that people who already have conclusion about something before an independent investigation are dumbasses. Pumo has let himself fall into that catergory.

I didn’t even post the article, pumo, did you read my post? All I did was post a picture taken by the associated press. Perhaps wtop has a secret conspiracy to dupe people into thinking that the attack took place in Israel, and made up the caption, when it was really in Lebanon. Or maybe you are just a silly toolbag.

sense,
try and keep it at least a little interesting for anyone beyond the circle jerk, keep the personal stuff out.

Yeah, you posted the picture connected to a garbage article, the two work together otherwise the picture is absolutely nothing (AP would never lie right?).

and ps- the picture was bought by the AP. and no wtop is just some crap rag, that’s all, you really are stupid man if you think winning an arguement you created yourself (straw man theory) is anything beyond believing yer beautiful cause yer right hand seems to be hot for ya (sorry for the personal, but you really are a fukin idiot that ain’t up to debate).

the link is here to our banter and sense’s use of straw man again, if any of the three people actually reading this care…

ok, so the AP is now lying about the location of the tank in order for your theory to be true.

Pumo, you’re a moron. What you are saying here is almost as stupid as your silly garbage on the suicide/murder. You clearly don’t understand that starting off with conclusions without independent investigation is fucking stupid, and you are about as smart as a lot of conservative christian simpletons I know.

until anyone can prove that the picture is a fake, I’m inclined to believe that the attack took place in Lebanon. have fun.

Good gawd, y’all!

ok
last time and then i have to do some work. it shows a humvee blown up on the ‘israeli’ side of lebanon. we have no idea if this humvee was blown up as israelis responded to the original battle, etc.
Ap buys pics, editors then buy them and link them to stories. we haven’t heard from the photographer, we have no official time of the attack, or any other evidence that could put things into perspective, without it, it is merely a pic of a humvee attached to a story- it means nothing…

i don’t know where the attack occurred because the reporting is such shit. i’m not making any conclusions, although you have based on a stupid picture…

ps- it’s you that’s quoting conservative christian simpletons (do you know anything about the hidden imam, and how inflamatory that article is with regards to linking him to the pres of iran?)

“As the West drifts closer to a potential showdown over Iran’s nuclear program, followers of the Mahdi are getting ready for Judgment Day.
And many of them are convinced that President Ahmadinjead, who is considered by some as Allah’s shadow on Earth, will fulfill his divine mission to prepare the world for the coming of the Islamic savior.”

you fukin moron, you better back that up before slandering the Shia religion…

I’ve just been sitting back reading the back and forth, and what i think people just need to come to terms with is that no one in this situation is clean, not Isreal, not Hez, and the sooner people come to terms with this the sooner we can try to reconcile and fix the damage done by both sides

are you a trickster gazoobi, or are you bringing us the moon and stars (i think it’s the moon anyways)...
peace

SPIN-CYCLE “WAR ON TERROR” BLOOD RINSE

Outside of a trustworthy investigation (dreams die hard) the official MSM version looks like an Orwellian talking point.

As I mentioned elsewhere:

With Israel at the front door to Big Oil and water fields this looks like another “war on terror” bait and switch tactic for wider strategic policy over the Mid East and Eurasian theatres. A policy of corporate cartel hegemony for regional power grabs that enforce “pacification” of natives played right into the hands of western elites.

So, are official reports accurate or a lid on a fresh sting op?

This is begins to reek of a timeworn extension of the “Great Game” promoted by the usual oligarch parasites in charge of a DC-MSM puppet complex and cartel banking system.

you’re fucking hysterical, cartel.

you are awesome.

Changing the Story Two Times

5:41 AM ET, Associated Press Writer Joseph Panossian originally reported “The militant group Hezbollah captured two Israeli soldiers during clashes Wednesday across the border in southern Lebanon”

7:09 AM ET, Associated Press Writer Joseph Panossian had changed his report to read: “The Hezbollah militant group captured two Israeli soldiers during clashes along the Lebanese border on Wednesday.”

4:13 PM ET, Associated Press Writer Joseph Panossian had again changed his report, this time to read: “Hezbollah militants crossed into Israel on Wednesday and captured two Israeli soldiers. “

Okay, what I don’t get is this:
Let’s say Israel was conducting a commando raid in Lebanon. Why, then, would Israeli special forces be sneaking about with a tank or a Humvee? Driving around in a armoured vehicle kind of defies the point of a stealth mission, right?

to try and get the iraq war started in the weeks prior to the invasion, american pilots were sent on stepped up missions in the ‘no-fly zones’ at lower than normal altitudes (how it was described to me)....
it’s something that happened right before tonkin as well. iraqi’s call US soldiers, bush’s matchstick people…
in ww1, commanding officers would blow a whistle, and hundreds (sometimes thousands) of soldiers would climb out of the trenches to be blown away only feet from where they entered no-mans land (for years), etc. etc. etc.

“Driving around in a armoured vehicle kind of defies the point of a stealth mission, right?”

Stealth mission or direct provocation???

Gee look what happened a war started, how strange.

Shin Bet Vetoed Secret Israeli-Palestinian Peace Agreement

FACTS FOR MORONS: The attack that started this war was in Israel. I understand that in GNN land, anything is what you want it to be, however, in the real world, those are the facts.

However Israel’s campaign is not just about 2 soldiers. It is about a country (Lebanon) launching attacks on Israel. Lebanon has no right to attack Israel. I understand that Hezbollah whatever it is, is not the government, in most countries governments set national policy, however, this terror entitiy attacked Israel and the government of Lebanon refuses to act, therefore it makes no difference to Israel.

No country in the world would tolerate such a situation on its border. The attack on lebanon has 2 purpose, one official and one unofficial. The official reason is to eliminate Hezbollah as a military force that can attack Israel. Unoffically the second reason is to engrane in the people of Lebanon a fear of allowing Hezbollah to attack Israel from Lebanon.

They are getting the message despite their brave face and denials. I doubt if Lebanon will allow Hezbollah to attack Israel again.

I find it highly unlikely this occurred in Lebanon. Israel has had no reason to be in Lebanon for some time now, whereas patrolling the border has been necessary since withdrawal. Anything’s possible, I suppose, but what seems to reveal itself as a far more likely scenario requires a knowledge of both political history in the region AND religious ideology and motivation. I don’t believe many Westerners, in fact, many Middle Easterners, are fully aware of the religious ideological motivations of such militant groups such as Hezbollah. Extreme Shi’ism is largely based in the actualization of certain interpretations of how to bring about the Final Judgment, the End of Days, the Apocalypse. Ultimately, after the elimination of the Christians, the Jews, the Druze (not Muslims, broke off from Shiism about 1000 years ago), and any other people who have not accepted Islam, and the Judgment that will end with all Muslims going to Heaven, the world will continue on as a Paradise, with all people as good, true Muslims. This is a very real and powerful belief, and the extremists are giving their lives to help bring about these events. More moderate Shi’ites and other Muslims don’t necessarily agree with these interpretations, rather, support Hezbollah’s claims of fighting on behalf of land disputes and prisoner release, to many, justifiably so. But at a time when Iran’s leaders, just weeks before the conflict began, announced to their media the need to take action against the “evil Zionists” throughout the world, and are buying uranium from the Russians, it’s a bit suspicious that Hezbollah kidnapped and killed Israeli soldiers JUST before the G8 summit, whose main topic of discussion was supposed to be Iran’s nuclear plan but was instead, naturally, replaced by the conflict. Hezbollah is working with Iran for a number of reasons, including the shared belief that Israel, a Western democracy in the Middle East, is a threat to the Muslim world. Many agree, others don’t. My point is, had Israel’s trigger-happy Olmert NOT reacted in the same (unnecessarily forceful) manner as a response to the kidnappings and killings, Hezbollah would have begun rocket attacks anyhow. Make no mistake that this was purposefully premeditated, involved a number of various, powerful Iranian (and possible Syrian) leaders, and that Hezbollah would have continued an assault on Israel UNTIL it responded. Hiding among civilians to increase their death toll and expressing justifiable motives to the media was terribly effective in recruiting followers and mustering up anti-Israel sentiment world-wide. I think these are very important issues to be reviewed if asking ourselves “where were the soldiers kidnapped?”

Has anyone checked out who these imprisoned Lebanese are? Why are they imprisoned?

Why are they imprisoned?

jeez i dunno – perhaps they weren’t fast enough in prostrating themselves before the racially pure and, by virtue of their adopted religion, obviously superiour all conquering heroes of the IAF.

Or it could have been for refusing to lick Israeli boots? yeah that sounds about right